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Post Info TOPIC: DM-Amyrade (RC1)


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RE: DM-Amyrade (Alpha 1)
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No worries, I did understand what you meant m8 ;)

I already use that node instructions in Aly last year, nothing new nor complicated & I already intent to make materials that pulsate & such which you will see in B1.

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I have an issue...

Dunno why but when I actually add a brush in the link area & do a full rebuild, there is a invisible wall that appear near the shock platform ???

I did delete, remade, rebuild several times the added brushes but it seem the invisible wall come back ?

I didn't notice any HOM or holes anywhere, it's just that I get that weird prob. when I add a new brush specifically in the link gun area.

My question is simple, is there a trick in the editor to detect such invisible geometry a part in wireframe mode ?

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Unreal Old Friend

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My question is simple, is there a trick in the editor to detect such invisible geometry a part in wireframe mode ?


I usually found it on Lit & LightingOnly. I guess you missed something when using the Geometry Mode. A simple lift with the mouse cause a vertex to be misaligned, and a wild invisible face appear!
The solution is to snap all the vertices of the guilty brush one by one to the grid.
Same effect when the CSG is too heavy, the angles aren't factorial, or when deleting a vertex with the "del" key (or the "suppr",  if Azerty).

Also semi-solid for the win!


-- Edited by Foufoune_Rose on Wednesday 2nd of March 2011 08:19:50 PM

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Mmm...

Everything is looking fine in all mode (wireframe or geometry or lit or unlit).

I also work on the grid all the time & most if not all of the brush don't intersect with each other.

The last added brushes are also all snapped on the grid. So I can't say which is the guilty one.

Finally, I don't delete only vertex or faces, I delete the entire brush & make another one.

That is why I'm confuse.

Perhaps I have to much geometry. The map use around 2050 brushes atm.

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Feedback-Master ..

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I don't think it's the brush count, but the likely chance that something is off. You probably know what I know when it comes to brushes, but to emphasize wthat Foufoune stated, "semi-solid FTW".

If your brush isn't being used to occlude anything and it's not intersecting another brush (they don't work with subtractive and "brush sinking'), it should probably be a semi-solid.

Other than this, it might be a process of eliminating brushes to find which one is meshed up. Keep in mind that it may not be necessarily a brush in that same area.

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Yeah,

Well, I found the faulty one after deleting + rebuilding each time. It was a long process but at least I know where the prob is coming from.

I already started to use non solid brushes for stuff behind blocking volume & it work well.

As for solid or semi-solid brushes, I didn't really saw the difference except one the semi-solid seem to block projectile only because I can pass through them ?

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Feedback-Master ..

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stevelois wrote:
As for solid or semi-solid brushes, I didn't really saw the difference except one the semi-solid seem to block projectile only because I can pass through them ?


Umm, are you sure.  I have semi-solids in my current map and they work fine for blocking players and weapons.  Semi-solids just don't get put in with the BSP tree calculations, which is why you can't use them to occlude and interact with solids and subtracts.

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Amateur UT mapper

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BSP holes seems like working with a black box.


However I recently had one and was able to fix by looking for other brushes that share a side that is the same dimension as the hole. Then try moving that brush and see if it affects the hole. However in other cases I had to re do the brush but mess around trying to create it with fewer vertexes.

Good luck, tell us if you learn anything.

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Like I said, I fixed my problem yesterday.

The faulty brush was near the Stinger. That brush didn't touch at all the area where I was blocked. There is no vertex that touches each other neither.

I didn't had any HOM nor BSP holes neither.

When I found the faulty brush, the shape & size of the brush wasn't even close to the invisible wall shape in & size.

Nothing could tell me where to look at.

My solution was to delete brushes one by one & make a full rebuild each time.

I can't explain why but if I was only rebuilding geometry sometime even if the trouble was gone, after a full rebuild, it was there again ??????????

Anyway it's fixed now.

THX for your help guy's :D

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CSG
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I've read more about brushes on UDN smile

Very interesting.

I'm converting some of the brushes atm. The map use more than 2300 brushes now, amazing !

At least most of the map as the proper solidity (solids & non solids) & I'm converting the solids one in semi-solids if doable.

This is slowing dows the release of B1 but at least the map will be error free biggrin

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CSG prob is back again !
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Damn BSP !

I add like 12 brushes in the map, which took me around 1 hour to do them before choosing the final BSP brush shape & after a full rebuild, the damn annoying invisible wall just reappear at the other side of the map !

I spend like 6 hours today just to get rid of that problem without resolving it !

This is damn annoying & frustrating. Sometime the editor drive me nuts !!!

The worst is when I do a geometry rebuild, the prob is gone BUT when I do a full rebuild it come back !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



-- Edited by stevelois on Monday 28th of March 2011 12:37:21 AM

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Unreal Old Friend

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DM-Amyrade (Alpha 1)
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Seems like you could need Blitz' "BSP protection textures".

 

Did you try placing a decorative brush (for example a ledge at a wall) where the invisible wall is? Sometimes problems can be solved by doing this. I did that in a UT99 map recently and it worked quite well.

 

PS: It would be better if it would be a solid brush I guess.



-- Edited by Sly on Monday 28th of March 2011 12:45:59 AM

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LOL

Yes, I need protection :D

The invisible wall appear in a path where meshes can't be added. Beside, this map is 100% BSP, no meshes allowed.

Changing the brushes in solid or semi-solid don't fix my prob :(

I post my prob on Epic just in case...



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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You'll probably find a brush that's on the same plane (x, y or z), near the affected area that is causing the BSP hole.
Look at any subtractive brushes near the affected area and do some tweaking on them and work out which one is causing the hole. Once you find it delete it and recreate it..or leave it in is modified state.



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That is my problem Mike, the last brush additions I've made aren't touching in any way the spot where the invisible wall appear.

To have an idea, in this screenshot the yellow square is where I add the latest brushes while the red square show where the invisible wall appear.

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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Aside from ya issue that screenshot looks pretty bloody good M8! beer.gif

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THX m8 biggrin

I'm happy you like the result so far smile



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Unreal Old Friend

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stevelois wrote:

That is my problem Mike, the last brush additions I've made aren't touching in any way the spot where the invisible wall appear.

To have an idea, in this screenshot the yellow square is where I add the latest brushes while the red square show where the invisible wall appear.

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version


 The butterfly-effect.

Try moving those brushes you added before the "wall"/BSP error reappeared. Placing simplier brushes might work as well (better to have worse visuals than a BSP error that kills you because you shoot rockets against it when standing in front of it by accident... I had that happen *lucky*)

 



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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Was that 'mountian shaped' cut, within the yellow area, one of the newest additions with which the hole appeared?
If so do as Sly suggested, try simplier brushes or even achieve the same shape buy using more simplier brushes to make it.

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Unreal Old Friend

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If ya got some errors with some subtractives brushes to make your shapes, try the opposite.
Use additives instead, and vice-versa.
And grid alignement is the best way to have a proper CSG cut.
You can change the CSG cut also by ctrl+x/ctrl+v some brushes. When you do that, you're changing the "priority" of the brushes (intersection) and the coplanar faces are merged (if textures aligned).

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Another thing I forgot to say is that I always work on the grid.

I already delete - rebuild - copy - paste - rebuild process before posting my issue.

One odd thing is that I add some brushes in the yellow area, then the prob appear in the red area. I deleted the new brushes & even more of them that are close, full rebuild & the prob come back !

It's really a huge nonsense since there is not supposed to be any issue if the new brushes + the old brushes are deleted.

But anyway, after spending almost all my Sunday on that damn prob, I delete some bushes close to the problematic area. Brushes that where there since 2 months !

The prob. is gone for the moment & I hope it won't come back anytime soon.

THX all for your help, much appreciated.

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Progress...
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This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version



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Amateur UT mapper

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Looking good Steve! But please stop teasing... biggrin



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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Achernar wrote:

Looking good Steve! But please stop teasing... biggrin


 +1!



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Unreal Old Friend

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UNREAL.









Reminded me much of Chizra.

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LOL

THX m8's biggrin

I wanted to show you some progress since it as been a while my threads here & Epic  aren't been updated wink



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Progress...
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Remember the KEG "flat" floor in A1 & the dull exit ?

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

RL spot, almost finished.

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

A overall look. You can see I have work to do on the lighting in the background but it's coming.

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

The non finished bezerk spot lol. At least you can see I've made great progress since a long time at that spot ! It's the only remaining place where I have the checkerboard material.

This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version



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Amateur UT mapper

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Those custom jump pads look good - fits in well. I'm liking the red emissive strips - starting to give more vibrancy to the level. Need more to offset the grey imo.
The blue lighting coming off the floor is a nice touch. From the pic at least some edging might help break up the sharp boundary between the floor and walls there.

Great work all up - Looking forward to trying it out :)



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Yep, I intend to use them more, the redish color :)

It's coming, it's coming :)

THX again !

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...ǝp¡s ɹǝɥʇo ǝɥʇ uo

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i like a lot ur "ambiant darkness", it makes the colors strongest and brighty
all thoses "haloish" signs look so familiar

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Yeah, well, the map won't be very bright, just a bit more than now.

The lights are set to 0.2 in many places so it won't be to bright because I want a sort of dark atmosphere :)

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A little update about this map.

I've made some progress since my last update but not enough for my taste. Still, I'll upload B1 later tonight or this w-e to gather a general feedback.

I dunno if I will be able to finish it for the deadline. But I don't mind since I already have 3 maps completed anyway (Amissa + NE + Itarion). If I can't make it on time, I'll add it in pack # 3 if we're still able to make one or in standalone.

Later m8.

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DM-Amyrade (B1)
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So, B1 is available after so many months ! biggrin

Read first post for details smile

THX



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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My son summed this up quite well in one statement "This map looks really cool!"
Plays a treat, layout is excellent and I like ya custom materials!

Not sure what else ya need to do with this but so far it looks superb M8!

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Looks like a real treat biggrin will try and get a look at it soon. smile



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@LPS

Ah, it's cool then you both like it & found it pretty biggrin Would you leave it like this without adding anymore brushes confuse

@Achernar

Hope you will like it too bud smile Tell me if you think it need more deco aww



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Amateur UT mapper

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Hey Steve, just had a few rounds and must the map is look impressive!

Feels alot like the Liandri chaple.  

Here are few areas that stood out

screenshot00294.jpg

 The green hexagon push the feel from techy to organic - the next step in evolution...

screenshot00295g.jpg

 The energy beam is looking pretty cool wink

screenshot00296.jpg

I like the design of this walkway. 

screenshot00297.jpg

 Very cool design.  the circuit patter could use some pulsation say with dust / cloud panner (just a thought)

screenshot00298.jpg

I really like the jump pads.  This area is a little confusing.  At first I had no idea what the purpose was, perhaps some warning strips along the base would help. The only other thing is some ambient asteroids or shooting stars as it look a little empty.

Very cool job all up. I can see this one becoming a favorite on servers wink

Oh yeah and hats off for persevering with all those bsp holes.



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THX for checking it out bud :)

About the possible material dust / cloud paner addition, it was like that at first but I've removed them, it was looking too busy / distracting since the size of this material aww

The lower jumpads area is just a risky exit from the belt spot (don't remember the old KEG placement?). I add them for flow+gamplay reasons smile

I know what you mean about adding stuff in space below the blue forcefield. I agree it look nude but adding meshes is out of the question if you've read the first post. It's against my personal rules for this map. I've thought of adding spaceships (movers) that just pass below but it's not worthy enough. Strips along the base is a good idea wink

So I think I'll finish the area I have in mind & release RC1. Look like most of you like it like that. I'll surely reach 3000 brushes soon lol biggrin

THX again!



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Connoisseur of Bourbon!

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I don't think anything really needs changing apart from some kind of warning for that floor field.

With Achernar's comments about doing something with that circuit pattern I recommend just donig a subtle pulse on the material so it goes a little bit brighter then back to it's normal setting. That way it doesn't look 'too busy' while looking more alive!

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No worries.

About adding stuff below the blue force field, I understand you reasons but in this case, could such an effect be done in the material editor, perhaps using matinee to generate a random presentation of shooting stars?

The other thing I'm found a little confusing is the physics vol. that pushes you up to the enforcer (i think)? This is a one ticket, as you can't go down. Not sure what is a good substitute, normally I'd think of creating a gate that opens when when you enter form below. So maybe just a visual cue like 'one way only' at the top or some particles that show its a wind tunnels?

Well this is shaping up very nicely all up - keep up the good work.

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Can you show me something about "random presentation of shooting stars" because I have no idea about that ???

Well, I thought of adding decals to inform players there is a force field so they can go up but I didn't add them since I don't want to use human letters like "lift" & such. I think I'll just add a emitter like the jumpads so it will be enough.

THX bud :)

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Unreal Old Friend

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If you continue your impressive work like that, I'll start calling you BSP-master very soon! I mean, I've seen a lot of stuff but your BSP architecture in this one is simply stunning! :O

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THX for the compliment m8 :)

BSP master sound cool but if you look at Crazy top maps, they are much eavier in brush counts!

I'm happy you like it. For me, it's quite ordinary.

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Unreal Old Friend

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Ok, then I'll call you BSP-Master and Crazy will be now nicknamed the BSP-Master-Sergeant-Shooter-Person. Can we agree on that?

I wouldn't add asteroids to the skybox like Achernar said, I would rather want to see some neat nebulas, I think they fit the mysterious tech-mood much better.
Overall I must say your map reminded me of Skaarj tech, just in blue and some red influence. Maybe you should consider making a Skaarj-themed map someday?

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Ha ha :)

I agree on whatever you choose to call me m8 as long as it's positive :)

Indeed, I can add some LPS nebula's but whatever I'll add below, I don't think it worth the trouble since no one will look there anyway. I do plan to add more BSP under the base as I already done on top of the base but not really something at the skydome level.

I would want to create a Skaarj-themed map or other specific theme map but because of missing assets I don't think I'll be able to create such maps :(

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Unreal Old Friend

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I think the community would be willing to help you out on that part!
I could even extract UT2004 Skaarj textures if you would need them, that would be no big deal. They have a nice resolution.

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It's an idea, but I'm to lazy to create all normal maps for all textures.

I've started another DM last week, dunno what it will be like yet lol

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Feedback-Master ..

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I played a round and do a quick scan on the comments for the last week so forgive me if I repeat something.  Sorry I don't have any pictures, but I am a bit short on time.  I will be more detailed in the next review (especially if it's after the map pack is released wink).

  1. Overall I really like the entire theme of the map.  It reminds me somewhat of a Stargate map, don't ask me why.  As Sly mentioned, your BSP work is really great as well as your attention to detail.
  2. I really like the pictures of the assorted robots.  I always play as a robot character in UT games.
  3. Jump pad sounds could be a bit louder.
  4. The lifts could be a bit more noticeable (maybe a animated material on the wall that the player can see right before they go up the lift?  This is mainly for the lifts that are "cut out" of the floor.
  5. A lift or two could be a bit bigger, just something to keep in mind.
  6. I don't kknow if you have done this, but I think having blocking volumes would really help the map.  Game play can get a bit "hectic" and while the map is fairly open, it also has a bunch of "weird" angles and openings, which can catch the player.
  7. The gravity tunnels is a bit odd to me and may slow game play down a little bit since you seemed to go above the exit door, then come back down.  Also, do the bots use this well?
  8. As others might have said, some sort of visual warning on the floors above the blue force field floor would be nice, even if it's just a red glowing trim or something similar.
  9. I think the lift that exits the shield belt should only be able to be used from the floor (maybe adding a door at the top).  To me, it's way easier to just jump down it instread of risking your life by the blue force field floor.
  10. One or two times I got turned "sideways' when I exted the teleporter.  I also saw bots have problems with it as well.
  11. Can I add my "maybe a little fog might help give it some more atmosphere", since I say that to every map in the world??? biggrin
  12. If you need help with creating normal maps, I am willing to help/try.  I don't know which ones need it, but as I always say.... "I can use the practice".

The map is looking great and playing well.  The earlier pictures didn't really look all that "great", they don't do the map justice, I guess you need to play it.

Keep up the great work.



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Great you had the time to play it & share your thoughts :D I fully understand your time is "tight" ;)

This is a good list :)

Happy you like it so far & will look at all those points when I'll get back to the map. THX bud !"

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I didn't really work on it since the B1 release. After I look at it yesterday, I realize that I should had mace many MIC but redoing all of material to make the map smaller is to much work. I was aware that I could do MIC last year but didn't know how to setup the node correctly.

So I did a bit of work on it & so far I :

- Add a trim above the blue force field.
- Add a light volume to the blue force field to replace like 30 point lights (this is a first for me for that kind of volume) !
- Add fogdensity, the regular heightfog was looking very bad.
- Removed 1 texture & optimize many materials.
- Raise the jumppads sounds.

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A blog dedicated to UE4, UDK, UT99 / 2004 / III / 4.

All UT4 CTF custom mapsAll UT4 remakesUE4 links (guide, tut)UE4 resourcesSoftware tools & resources.

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